"i86hotdogs" (i86hotdogs)
11/08/2020 at 09:10 • Filed to: None
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"i86hotdogs" (i86hotdogs)
11/08/2020 at 09:10 • Filed to: None | 0
| 36 |
I grew up in a very safe neighborhood in the suburbs of Chicago. My family and I rarely expe rienced petty crimes growing up, therefore the necessity to be prepared for the worst was not a priority (my parents words, not mine). My folks also don’t believe owning a firearm whatsoever is a necessity; similar to their take on tattoos and owning multiple vehicles.
Through my life, I’ve lived in safe and unsafe neighborhoods. I’ve been fortunate enough to stay safe through that tenure, even while living in Warren, Michigan which does not have a great notoriety.
I now live in a relatively safe suburb of Cleveland, and in the two years of living here, had two close encounters that luckily did not escalate to violence. One was a very intoxicated resident of the neighboring apartments banging on our door thinking it was her house. She finally figured out her mistake and apologized profusely. I caught another individual peeking through our mudroom window. I was awake watching tv, and confronted him. He claimed he was looking for his friend, but I had my doubts. He hustled off down the road after I told him to leave before I call the cops.
reenactment
I’ve always wanted to own at least one firearm. I’ve gone shooting at ranges with friends and enjoyed it thoroughly. I also believe one reliable firearm is a smart home defense method (and a lot more effective than the croquet mallet that currently is out defense system) . But I know getting in to that scene is not cheap, and I already am hemorrhaging money in to other hobbies and habits. So I always put it off for “when I have expendable money”.
I recently came across a few hundred bucks towards Cabela’s and thought this would be a perfect opportunity to finally acquire something for home defense. So I’ve been researching and online shopping for a pistol lately. I am your typical novice looking to get in to the scene, so I am learning about different ammo sizes, trigger styles, rimfire vs. centerfire, the list goes on.
Ohio law doesn’t require a permit or license to own a pistol. And I don’t plan on conceal & carry it ever. My record is clean, so the background check should pass with flying colors (unless they deduct for traffic violations /s). I have a lock safe that usually has our birth certificates and other important documents, and it’s large enough to store a pistol too. The box sits under my bed in an arms reach. I am setting a budget for $300-$400 not including ammo or attachments. It seems the consensus for ammo is 9mm for a basic firearm. Cheap and plentiful.
Here’s what I found on Cabela’s website
All are in budget, all have great reviews, but they all look the same to me. I know I need to go in and see how they feel in hand, and see if they even have any in stock with everything going on now.
Once acquired, I plan on taking myself and the missus to the nearest range for some training and opportunity to shoot some rounds off. As for attachments, the only two I see necessary are night sights and maybe a flashlight under the barrel.
What say you Oppo? Open to all advice and criticism.
Khalbali
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 09:20 |
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Nothing is cheap and plentiful right now unfortunately, I'm trying to get into it too but just for target shooting so I'll be sticking with a .22lr revolver, but ammo is crazy expensive and hard to come by at the moment.
Manny05x
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 09:23 |
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I have a smith and wesson sd9ve, its basically a poor mans glock, great gun for home defense. I attached a flashlight to it in case i have to use it at night (i hope i never use it.) I have my conceal permit but i dont carry my gun around. I plan on buying a glock when i have extra cash a G43x to carry.
CB
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 09:25 |
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To start, I’m anti-gun for home self defence for a number of reasons (unsecured firearms worry me). But why are you choosing a pistol over a shotgun? A shotgun is easier to shoot accurately , and nothing deescalates people like hearing a shotgun being racked.
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i86hotdogs
> CB
11/08/2020 at 09:32 |
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I like the compact size and the ability to secure it in my lock box. If I were to get a shot gun, I’d have to purchase an actual gun safe. Which almost doubles my budget.
vondon302
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 09:51 |
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Basically it comes down to fit too. I wanted a Smith but bought a Ruger just cause of feel.
Ammo is stupid expensive right now.
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i86hotdogs
> vondon302
11/08/2020 at 09:55 |
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I should clarify, 9mm is the cheapest out of the other variants. All still expensive.
Kiltedpadre
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 10:04 |
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Unfortunately at the moment no handgun ammunition is plentiful. I was in a Cabelas about 3 weeks ago and the only calibers available at all were calibers that haven’t been in popular use in ages.
Going to Cabelas remember most of their stores have an area where they sell used firearms. This may open up your options, but I’m willing to bet the selection is pretty limited right now.
Check your area for gun ranges. Quite a few of them let you rent guns while there. This would let you test drive any gun you’re considering before buying. Another benefit is some will also offer classes. I know a couple in my area offer classes specifically tailored to first time gun owners.
As far as calibers 9mm is a good option but don’t immediately discount .45acp or .38 special. If you’re just planning to use the gun for personal defense you won’t be shooting enough for the price difference to be a big deal, and both are readily available even at Walmart when supply levels return to normal.
Beyond that you’ll need to actually go to the gun store. The gun needs to be comfortable in your hand. If your wife plans to learn to shoot she’ll want to go too. A gun that’s comfortable in your hand may be too big for her to use. For just around the house there’s no need to look at anything with “compact” or “carry” in the name (unless you need the smaller size for grip comfort). The longer sight radius of a full size will be easier to get on target.
I know storage is a consideration but I’ll echo what someone else said. A short barreled pump shotgun is the best home defense option if you’re going to own a single gun. I’ll even say if you go that route get a 20ga instead of a 12ga. The ammunition is almost always the same price and it’ll be much easier to manage.
If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 10:12 |
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l’ve fired Rugers before and they're pretty nice quality for the price.
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Khalbali
> CB
11/08/2020 at 10:13 |
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I agree with the home defense thing, to me it just seems to make everything worse, but I’m about as progressive a (potential) gun owner as can be, I understand hunting even though it doesn’t interest me, but to me it’s just a fun hobby full stop, I still might just keep mine at the range.
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i86hotdogs
> Kiltedpadre
11/08/2020 at 10:15 |
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All great tips. I emphasized the storage just to practice safe gun ownership habits. If I’m going to do it, I want to do it right.
I did see the used section on their site. But selection was limited (literally three guns). I know a lot of my questions can be answered by goin in there, but the nearest one is about an hour away.
I do plan on taking classes at the local range with the missus. I wasn’t aware you could rent firearms to try as well. That could help me in my decision too.
The more you guys and gals are recommending a shotgun over a pistol, the more appealing it sounds. I’ll research that too.
atfsgeoff
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 10:19 |
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Long guns are far easier to fire accurately under stress than pistols. If defense is your primary usage intent, an AR-15 is objectively superior in every way to almost any centerfire pistol. More power, less recoil, more magazine capacity. Braced from the shoulder so you have less twitchy muscles to move you off-target under a stressful situation.
And contrary to popular myth, they are no louder than pistols either. ANY firearm fired indoors is deafeningly loud.
subexpression
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 10:20 |
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I’m not sure I’d go for any of those, honestly. A couple of the ones in the list are .22's, not 9mm . If those were my only options , I’d probably take one of the M&P’s. Maybe see how the Ruger feels in my hand first, it’s just that they’re not as common out in the world so they don’t have the same options for accessories or community advice . The trouble I see with thos e M&Ps is that the smaller one has a short barrel and I don’t see an accessory rail, which it sounds like you should have for mounting a light . But the larger one has a thumb safety, which means you will need more practice time to use it well.
Some shooting ranges have pistols available for rental. Once you’ve narrowed your options y ou might see if you can find one to try for an hour before you make a final decision.
All t hat said, you should only rely on a pistol for defense if you are ready to make a serious commitment to learning to handle it correctly without thinking . Pistols are not that easy to shoot well . Y ou need to remember that you will be under serious stress if you ever have to use a weapon in a defensive situation . It’s easy to get things wrong under pressure. If there is any question about that commitment, maybe start with a shotgun or a big can of OC spray .
koawaft1
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 10:24 |
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If it is truly for home defense, a shotgun is best. When you miss it won't go through walls and hit family members. Also if you heard a window break and then footsteps, then they heard the "click-click", they will get the message. It is more intemidating.
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i86hotdogs
> subexpression
11/08/2020 at 10:25 |
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Good point on the shorter barrels. The accessories aren’t necessary, just what was recommended since most break-ins occur at night.
Seems the popular suggestion here is to go with a shotgun over a pistol. I’m starting to look in to that as well.
thanks for the advice!
krustywantout
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 10:27 |
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As mentioned, a shotgun is the best weapon for home defense. A tactical shotgun is not as big and actually better for close quarters defense. I
have this on order:
https://www.keltecweapons.com/firearms/shotguns/ksg/
As for hand guns, anything from Sig is a good buy. A friend of mine has one of these:
https://www.sigsauer.com/store/p320-rxp-compact.html
I have a H&K 9mm hand gun that's heavy but very smooth.
If you really want to get crazy:
https://kriss-usa.com/item/vector-sdp-overview/
Or:
https://kriss-usa.com/item/vector-crb/
The Kiss Vectors are super smooth and by far one of the nicest handguns I have ever fired.
DipodomysDeserti
> CB
11/08/2020 at 10:39 |
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Very bad idea to plan on someone will be indimidated by the gun, especially in America. If the gun comes out, it better be because you’re going to shoot someone. We have enough guns here that there’s a good chance someone breaking into a house has had one pointed at them before.
Exhibit 1, these idiots:
No one gave a shit that the guy has an AR-15 in his hands. Take a look at some of the shootings at protests here as well. People standing in front of the shooters yelling at them to shoot (which they did). A friend of mine killed someone in a similar situation. He thought brandishing an AK47 would calm the situation. It didn’t, and he had to shoot a kid who tried to stab him once he got back to his car.
Penetration can also be an issue with shotguns if you’re in an apartment or townhouse. I know from personal experience that brick and adobe will eat up 00 buck, but drywall and wood won’t.
66P1800inpieces
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 10:46 |
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Do you have kids? If not a couple cans of OC spray as the are easy to use and quicker to grab than going to a safe.
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DipodomysDeserti
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 10:46 |
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Proper training is going to cost more than the firearm, especially right now. You’ll spend more on ammo (if you can find it) for a decent class than a decent pistol costs. For people just looking for something that works, I’d go with a Glock 19 or 17. I think you’re a bigger guy, so a 17 might feel better in the hand.
Without training, you’re better off with the mallet (or a big dog). I’ve had pitbulls my whole adult life, and despite living in some sketchy areas, have never had anyone attempt to break in. I have quite a bit of training and ammo, but the guns are an absolute last resort. I can tell you from experience that people willing to break into a house will not get scared at the sight of a gun.
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i86hotdogs
> 66P1800inpieces
11/08/2020 at 10:47 |
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No kids. And the dog has no opposable thumbs.
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i86hotdogs
> DipodomysDeserti
11/08/2020 at 10:48 |
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If I recall correctly, the Glock 17 is the smaller one right?
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DipodomysDeserti
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 10:59 |
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It’s the larger one. The 17 is full sized, the 19 is compact.
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i86hotdogs
> DipodomysDeserti
11/08/2020 at 11:10 |
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had it backwards . dangit
SBA Thanks You For All The Fish
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 11:17 |
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For stopping power you want a 9mm. A meth-fueled attacker won’t even notice a 22, especially if aim is erratic .
You’re not C-C’ing, so you might at least want to consider a shotgun instead if “home invasion” or “night robbery” is the profile you are concerned about. You have a wider spread- and a choice in shot to stop whatever is headed your way. Aim is *ahem* less of an issue.
S&W Shield is well respected, and comes in smaller mag sizes— if that’s a factor as it is in CA.
I have a love-hate with the Glocks, but with no safety, fumbling around in the dark? At least you will get a shot off sans safety.
Good luck. I hate those scenarios, but it’s the modern world.
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Kiltedpadre
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 11:17 |
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Both Remington and Mossberg make shotguns marketed towards home defense. You’ll basically be looking at something with a barrel in the 18.5-20” range. Both are excellent options. The biggest difference will be where the safety is located. Remington has it on the side of the trigger guard. Mossberg on top of the receiver. I think the Mossberg safety is easier to operate, but with practice either would become intuitive.
The only other real consideration is if you think you might try skeet or trap shooting in the future. This matters because some models will be sold that hold more rounds than their hunting equivalent. If you buy what is basically a hunting shotgun with the shorter barrel you can buy a second barrel that can be swapped on easily for clays use. This isn’t an option with one that holds extra rounds. Needless to say an extra barrel for a gun is cheaper than a second gun.
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SBA Thanks You For All The Fish
> DipodomysDeserti
11/08/2020 at 11:18 |
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They WILL notice a shotgun. And, really notice the 0-0 buck...
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SBA Thanks You For All The Fish
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 11:19 |
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If you go that direction, look at a G26 as well.
As I said in the other comment it’s a ‘push’ on the Glock trigger... but you will get shots off with it anyway.
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SBA Thanks You For All The Fish
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 11:21 |
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I wouldnt completely forget accessories. IN a night encounter? Rail lighting is a good thing. Lots of options on common stuff.
Would reiterate the comments on the .22-- It won’t really stop shit. A 9mm or larger is advisable.
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i86hotdogs
> Kiltedpadre
11/08/2020 at 11:22 |
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Great points! Who knows, I could get in to trap shooting. I’ve never hunted, and probably wont on my own any time soon.
GoodIdeaAtTheTime
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 11:23 |
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If it is for home defense only, and you are set on a hand gun, and you don’t plan on carry, get a full size handgun. I would never recommend a semi auto .22 for defense, while perfectly acceptable as a self defense cartridge, reliability is an issue. In the affordable realm, I would recommend a Glock 17, Smith and Wesson M&P, CZ p10C or P10F. Any caliber is fine, they all do the same thing. I daily carry a P10C, I have a single shot 12 gauge for home defense, and a H&K G3 for back up, and it is a registered machine gun. no matter what you pick, just remember your neighbors, as those rounds are your responsibility. And if you absolutely have to bring it out, use it, and prepare to be arrested until the situation is sorted out. DO NOT pull a firearm just because you have one, exhaust all options first, but never turn your back unless you are sure you can get away. I made that mistake, once.
This is coming from someone that has had to defend her life, on several occasions. Taking a life, even in a life threatening situation, is hard to cope with.
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i86hotdogs
> GoodIdeaAtTheTime
11/08/2020 at 11:31 |
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I have the mentality that the best case scenario owning a gun is to never have to use it. I’m not entirely set on a handgun anymore after reading some suggestions here. So I’m open to anything. Whatever I decide on, I know I want to do it right and take the classes and do the research.
sn4cktimes
> krustywantout
11/08/2020 at 11:53 |
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Canadian chiming in here. While I’ll keep most of my gun opinions to myself I will say that at a range I liked several Sigsauer and H&K handguns the most. I have small hands and could operate their safeties and get the best grip with them over others I tried. I would echo a shotgun over handgun only on the basis of potential non lethality (can’t attack with shot up legs). And that’s as far as I’ll go there.
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SBA Thanks You For All The Fish
> vondon302
11/08/2020 at 11:55 |
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Feel is extremely important.
ClassicDatsunDebate
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 12:03 |
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You’ll shoot your eye out kid.
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i86hotdogs
> ClassicDatsunDebate
11/08/2020 at 12:16 |
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Waiting for this comment. Well done
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ClassicDatsunDebate
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 12:33 |
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There was 30 comments before mine and no one plucked this low lying fruit.
CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever
> i86hotdogs
11/08/2020 at 15:06 |
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Ruger pc9 Carbine. Longer barrel leads to higher muzzle velocity, take down barrel, runs Glock mags. You can mount a light on it and it's light and cheap